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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 3:07 am 
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Ray Gun wrote:
titan wrote:
Actually, under Romneycare or any program designed
Designed? :ha:

Every conservative knows that whatever you Progressive say the program is "designed" to do, it never does; and in fact, often accomplishes the opposite of what it was allegedly "designed" to do. That's why we conservates say things like The Department of No Energy, The Department of No Edcuation.

I like the way you say "ramping up the supply of providers." That's nice Progressive rhetoric there. Talk about people as units that you just push up a ramp.

Just in case you couldn't interpret the sarcasm, I have posted several times that according the US Census data, there are 16,000 less medical professionals in Massachusetts. So, of course, doctors are not moving to Massachusetts. They have been moving away. But if you get Romneycare nationalized, they won't have anywhere to run.


16,000 FEWER medical professionals (same thing as providers).

I don't want to disrupt your delusions, but I didn't support Romneycare or Obamacare. I'd hate to see Romneycare nationalized, and have already posted that it COULDN'T work because of unique funding advantages available to MA that wouldn't translate nationwide. I've also posted the importance of repealing Obamacare.

But, if it makes you feel better, press on!

FWIW, the thread is intended to be about the MLB 2012 season. There are numerous other places you can prattle on about Romney and Romneycare.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 3:47 am 
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titan wrote:
16,000 FEWER medical professionals (same thing as providers).
What is that? Marxist doubletalk? Romneycare is causing medical professionals to move to other states. This is part of why the studies show wait times increasing, and by more time than it takes Josh Beckett to fly to Texas. Maybe one of these days you candidate's system will actually kill you.

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I don't want to disrupt your delusions, but I didn't support Romneycare or Obamacare.
Sure you did. When I asked you if you had a "solution" to "free riders," you described a personal mandate system and defended it vehemently. Or have you seen the conservative light, now? Shook up your Etch-a-Sketch?


Last edited by Ray Gun on Tue Apr 03, 2012 4:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 4:07 am 
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sherwood wrote:
The Red Sox are "designed" to finish first... :ha: :ha: :ha:
With the new system, a third place team can now win the WS. It's Bud Selig's version of the Hunger Games.

Most of the talk is that the one-game elimination makes it "tougher" on the wild card teams, but doesn't seem to reflect that there is a team that will have it "tough" instead of impossible. a team that would have been eliminated in the regular season per the 2011 rules will move on in 2012. For example, if the 2012 rules had been in effect last year, the Red Sox would have played a one-game elimination with Tampa. (I know, I can hear you thinking, the Red Sox would have blown a 10-run lead in the last inning, anyway).


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 3:53 pm 
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I hate the Valsox. The last thing I want is to give them another chance. I hope they start their fade in August like they used to.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 5:46 pm 
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Ray Gun wrote:
...Sure you did. When I asked you if you had a "solution" to "free riders," you described a personal mandate system and defended it vehemently. Or have you seen the conservative light, now? Shook up your Etch-a-Sketch?


On Romneycare, I defended the difference between a state level plan based on private industry insurance, and a central government plan designed to become single payer, and control everyone's lives.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 6:04 pm 
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Exactly. You advocated statism. You made the same arguments the Obama Adminstration and the liberal justices made in the Supreme Court. This so-called - difference between state and federal - is the mootest point in the history of Earth. You are for top-down authoritarianism that usurps the unalienable rights of individuals to live free.

It was the typical- invent a boogeyman that only socialism can fix - argument that has come out of the mouth of every Statist since Plato.

I don't know why you keep struggling with this. We are saying the same thing. I am just translating it into the kind of stark language we conservatives use to describe philosophies like yours.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 11:56 pm 
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Ray Gun wrote:
Exactly. You advocated statism. You made the same arguments the Obama Adminstration and the liberal justices made in the Supreme Court. This so-called - difference between state and federal - is the mootest point in the history of Earth. You are for top-down authoritarianism that usurps the unalienable rights of individuals to live free.

It was the typical- invent a boogeyman that only socialism can fix - argument that has come out of the mouth of every Statist since Plato.

I don't know why you keep struggling with this. We are saying the same thing. I am just translating it into the kind of stark language we conservatives use to describe philosophies like yours.


Unfortunately you are full of horsecrap.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 10:06 am 
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Just stating facts.

You made the same so-called "cost shifting" arguments as the libs, with the same same solution as Obamacare - buy insurance or pay a penalty. These are your words, right?

Cost shifting argument
titan wrote:
Do you recall hearing that a 29 year old Sarah Burke recently died while performing extreme sports (her profession)? She decided to skip the expense of health insurance and let us pick up the tab.


Buy insurance or pay a penalty
titan wrote:
Under my proposal, individuals would choose coverage or no coverage, and what levels of coverage they purchase. They would purchase the product from a private company competing nationally on price and service.
If they choose not to participate, they would effectively ACCEPT the tax to support the others who make the same choice
for anyone who was paying attention, insisting that it is a tax and not a penalty was critical to their argument. And here you were making Obama's argument months before his lawyers made it in front of the Supreme Court. Remember? I posted the Obamacare law Sec 1510, where it says must buy insurance or pay a penalty.

You want to advocate the Lefty position on health care without being told you are a Lefty. Face it, dude. You are a Massachusetts liberal. :ha:

How about those Sawx? Where have those guys been putting their thumbs?


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 4:23 pm 
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Ray Gun wrote:
Just stating facts.

You made the same so-called "cost shifting" arguments as the libs, with the same same solution as Obamacare - buy insurance or pay a penalty. These are your words, right?

Cost shifting argument
titan wrote:
Do you recall hearing that a 29 year old Sarah Burke recently died while performing extreme sports (her profession)? She decided to skip the expense of health insurance and let us pick up the tab.


Buy insurance or pay a penalty
titan wrote:
Under my proposal, individuals would choose coverage or no coverage, and what levels of coverage they purchase. They would purchase the product from a private company competing nationally on price and service.
If they choose not to participate, they would effectively ACCEPT the tax to support the others who make the same choice
for anyone who was paying attention, insisting that it is a tax and not a penalty was critical to their argument. And here you were making Obama's argument months before his lawyers made it in front of the Supreme Court. Remember? I posted the Obamacare law Sec 1510, where it says must buy insurance or pay a penalty.

You want to advocate the Lefty position on health care without being told you are a Lefty. Face it, dude. You are a Massachusetts liberal. :ha:

How about those Sawx? Where have those guys been putting their thumbs?


Presumably, your 'non-lefty' plan is to have anyone who doesn't want insurance (including illegal immigrants) to ignore the expense until they become sick and then charge us taxpayers and responsible citizens for all of their costs.

You and I definitely disagree on that.

I proudly declare myself to not be an 'anarcho-libertarian'.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 9:32 pm 
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Geez, I thought this was a baseball thread. You know, Yankees and all that. Obamacare has all the charm of a dirty Christmas card and should be dealt with elsewhere.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 9:37 pm 
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titan wrote:
Presumably, your 'non-lefty' plan is to have anyone who doesn't want insurance (including illegal immigrants) to ignore the expense until they become sick and then charge us taxpayers and responsible citizens for all of their costs.
Plan? No. Central planning is for you lefties.

And under your plan, what happens when they don't pay the tax because have no money? Or when their medical bills are $100k more than tax? The cost gets shifted anyway right? You haven't solved anyting.

Are you aware that ever business that ever existed, survives by cost shifting? And you think you can get rid of it?


Last edited by Ray Gun on Wed Apr 04, 2012 9:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 9:37 pm 
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sherwood wrote:
Geez, I thought this was a baseball thread. You know, Yankees and all that. Obamacare has all the charm of a dirty Christmas card and should be dealt with elsewhere.

Amen!

The season is officially open. Let's play ball.

Tigers open with the Red Sox tomorrow at 1:05. In honor of the Sox I'll be drinking beer and eating fried chicken by 9:30. :gcheer:


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 9:51 pm 
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Kad wrote:
sherwood wrote:
Geez, I thought this was a baseball thread. You know, Yankees and all that. Obamacare has all the charm of a dirty Christmas card and should be dealt with elsewhere.

Amen!
The season is officially open. Let's play ball.
Tigers open with the Red Sox tomorrow at 1:05. In honor of the Sox I'll be drinking beer and eating fried chicken by 9:30. :gcheer:
You think Cabrera is going to a few more grounders off his head?


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:05 am 
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Ray Gun wrote:
titan wrote:
Presumably, your 'non-lefty' plan is to have anyone who doesn't want insurance (including illegal immigrants) to ignore the expense until they become sick and then charge us taxpayers and responsible citizens for all of their costs.
Plan? No. Central planning is for you lefties.

And under your plan, what happens when they don't pay the tax because have no money? Or when their medical bills are $100k more than tax? The cost gets shifted anyway right? You haven't solved anyting.

Are you aware that ever business that ever existed, survives by cost shifting? And you think you can get rid of it?


Try to stay focused on baseball, and the general notion of not turning every thread you come across into a crap fest.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:08 am 
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titan wrote:
Ray Gun wrote:
titan wrote:
Presumably, your 'non-lefty' plan is to have anyone who doesn't want insurance (including illegal immigrants) to ignore the expense until they become sick and then charge us taxpayers and responsible citizens for all of their costs.
Plan? No. Central planning is for you lefties.

And under your plan, what happens when they don't pay the tax because have no money? Or when their medical bills are $100k more than tax? The cost gets shifted anyway right? You haven't solved anyting.

Are you aware that ever business that ever existed, survives by cost shifting? And you think you can get rid of it?


Try to stay focused on baseball, and the general notion of not turning every thread you come across into a crap fest.


Don't make me come in there, you two. Stick to baseball. :pout:

And I think Cabrera will be just fine at third base.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 5:36 am 
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Your the only one who thinks that. He's never been fine there before.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 6:09 am 
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Ray Gun wrote:
Your the only one who thinks that. He's never been fine there before.


He'll outperform A-Hole.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 6:33 am 
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Not in the field. A-Hole was below average on third for several years, but has improved.

Last time the Tigers put Cabrera at third, he made 5 errors in 14 games. I am sure he could outperform me. :ha:

No matter how you bandy the rhetoric around, having this guy in the field for the season instead of at DH is going to cost the Tigers at least 10 and maybe 25 runs. That is, if as I said before he took one in the face, if he doesn't hurt himself pretending to be a third baseman.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 7:32 am 
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Ray Gun wrote:
Not in the field. A-Hole was below average on third for several years, but has improved.

Last time the Tigers put Cabrera at third, he made 5 errors in 14 games. I am sure he could outperform me. :ha:

No matter how you bandy the rhetoric around, having this guy in the field for the season instead of at DH is going to cost the Tigers at least 10 and maybe 25 runs. That is, if as I said before he took one in the face, if he doesn't hurt himself pretending to be a third baseman.


Even if you are right, and he costs the Tigers 25 runs, replacing Brandon Inge's bat with Prince Fielder's bat will increase their run production by 3 times that.

I'll take that trade every day of the week.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 4:47 pm 
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Kad wrote:
Even if you are right, and he costs the Tigers 25 runs, replacing Brandon Inge's bat with Prince Fielder's bat will increase their run production by 3 times that.
I'll take that trade every day of the week.
But the tradeoff is not Inge v Fielder. Fielder is not a variable. If Cabrera DH's or plays 3rd, Fielder doesn't change.

It's the runs they give up with Cabrera at 3rd instead of DH; less (or plus) the run differential of between whoever plays 3rd instead and whoever isn't the DH (Delmon Young?). I think even Delmon Young would be better at 3rd than Cabrera.

The root of this is that Cabrera is not a team player. He won't do the right thing and be DH.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 7:27 am 
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Low scores, three shutouts, five runs per game, only one game above average
1-0
1-0
2-1
4-0
3-2
5-3
7-4


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 7:38 am 
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Ray Gun wrote:
Kad wrote:
Even if you are right, and he costs the Tigers 25 runs, replacing Brandon Inge's bat with Prince Fielder's bat will increase their run production by 3 times that.
I'll take that trade every day of the week.
But the tradeoff is not Inge v Fielder. Fielder is not a variable. If Cabrera DH's or plays 3rd, Fielder doesn't change.

It's the runs they give up with Cabrera at 3rd instead of DH; less (or plus) the run differential of between whoever plays 3rd instead and whoever isn't the DH (Delmon Young?). I think even Delmon Young would be better at 3rd than Cabrera.

The root of this is that Cabrera is not a team player. He won't do the right thing and be DH.


Inge' bat was in the lineup last year. Fielder's bat is in the lineup this year instead. That's the trade and Fielder's bat will knock in a bunch of runs that Inge's bat would have fanned.

Fielder will knock in between 75 and 100 runs this year, at a minimum (since becoming a full time player he has averaged 106 RBI). Inge hit .197 with 3 home runs and 23 RBI last year. If your guess of 25 runs given up by putting Cabrera at third is even close to accurate, Fielder being in the lineup will knock in at least twice and more likely 3 times the number of runs that Cabrera gives up with his glove, by your own estimation (which I believe will be high).

We'll see what we see. But I'm done arguing this point with you, especially since apparently all you want to do is argue.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 8:09 am 
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Kad wrote:
Inge' bat was in the lineup last year. Fielder's bat is in the lineup this year instead. That's the trade and Fielder's bat will knock in a bunch of runs that Inge's bat would have fanned.
That is correct, no matter how many times you repeat it.

This is not arguing, BTW. Arguing would entail disagreeing about the answer to a question. I am just trying to get you to grasp what the question is.

Line-up 1: Cabrera DH, Inge(?) 3B
Line-up 2: Cabrera 3B, Young DH

Notice the difference between the two lineups is not Fielder.
The runs gained by Inge's glove v Cabrera's glove
+/- runs gained by Young's bat v Inge's bat

You really can't see that?

Sherwood,
I notice in the box score that the Red Sox bullpen couldn't get anyone out. They pitched to 9 batters and gave up 3 hits and 1 walk. That doesn't bode for heads-up matchups with the Yankees.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 8:25 am 
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Yeah, Gun, I noticed that, too. Geez, I really feel bad for the Valsox not making the playoffs for the third straight year. I think I'm about...to smile. Like the time I came home and found my girl in a two-piece outfit, a right and left slipper.....as for the Tigers, Cabrera is a small problem. The rest of that infield I think is lousy. It's a good thing the Tigers can hit because they won't win any defensive awards.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 9:02 am 
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Actually, the best thing the Tigers have going for them is the Central Division. I actually feel sorry for the Orioles.

I'm still one of the more optomistic guys about the Red Sox. Remember, there are now TWO wild cards. Even if the Sox can't finish second in the East, they can still get a wild card.

And this is what I talk about, owners who don't try to win. Did you see who was the opening day starter for the Pirates? Erik Bedard? The Red Sox brought him in for a while last year, after shoulder problems with minor-league rehab for a couple of years with Seattle.

He pitched well, lost 1-0 to Hallidy, but still. That's probably the best game he threw in five years. This their #1? Hmm? Maybe if AJ weren't on the DL, he would have started. :)


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 6:32 pm 
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The Yankees are 0-3 and already I'm questioning Girardi's lineups. ...The Yankees only have three problems, pitching, hitting with runners on base and fielding..other than that it's a good start. Now on to 3-0 Baltimore. Shheeese! Everything is already upside down.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 7:23 am 
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With a mere five months left in the season, you're panicking already?


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:35 am 
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If they expect me to put in this time watching their games, I expect results. So far ...squat. Angst headquarters here.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:31 am 
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sherwood wrote:
The Yankees are 0-3 and already I'm questioning Girardi's lineups. ...The Yankees only have three problems, pitching, hitting with runners on base and fielding..other than that it's a good start. Now on to 3-0 Baltimore. Shheeese! Everything is already upside down.



I have to change my plans. I sat through almost all of the innings for the 3 games. It was brutal at best.

A 200 million dollar team and this is what we get for it? They couldn't even squeak out 1 game? :shake:

I think next time they're on I'll watch MSNBC or CNN instead. :shock:


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:33 am 
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Ray Gun wrote:
With a mere five months left in the season, you're panicking already?



It's not a panic.

You expect a 200 million dollar team to do a little better. That's all.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 2:42 pm 
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dniles365AmericanFirst wrote:
Ray Gun wrote:
With a mere five months left in the season, you're panicking already?
It's not a panic.
You expect a 200 million dollar team to do a little better. That's all.
So, if the payroll was lower, you'd be happy?

Sorry, but 3 baseball games by any team is an insufficient sample for sober analysts. (Oh, and BTW, that's not $200 mil, it's only $197 mil :) ).


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 2:46 pm 
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Ray Gun wrote:
dniles365AmericanFirst wrote:
Ray Gun wrote:
With a mere five months left in the season, you're panicking already?
It's not a panic.
You expect a 200 million dollar team to do a little better. That's all.
So, if the payroll was lower, you'd be happy?

Sorry, but 3 baseball games by any team is an insufficient sample for sober analysts. (Oh, and BTW, that's not $200 mil, it's only $197 mil :) ).



Paid less?


Probably. Parking would be cheaper. Food would be cheaper. Tickets would be cheaper. :gcheer:


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 3:14 pm 
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A fair-weather fan.


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 3:57 pm 
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dniles365AmericanFirst wrote:
Ray Gun wrote:
dniles365AmericanFirst wrote:
Ray Gun wrote:
With a mere five months left in the season, you're panicking already?
It's not a panic.
You expect a 200 million dollar team to do a little better. That's all.
So, if the payroll was lower, you'd be happy?

Sorry, but 3 baseball games by any team is an insufficient sample for sober analysts. (Oh, and BTW, that's not $200 mil, it's only $197 mil :) ).



Paid less?


Probably. Parking would be cheaper. Food would be cheaper. Tickets would be cheaper. :gcheer:


Does anyone know the breakdown of the income stream to the teams? How much is generated by tickets, concessions, etc. and how much is TV money?


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 Post subject: Re: MLB 2012 Season
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 4:51 pm 
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gartay wrote:
Does anyone know the breakdown of the income stream to the teams? How much is generated by tickets, concessions, etc. and how much is TV money?
Here is a start.
http://eh.net/encyclopedia/article/haupert.mlb


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